Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Lessons Learned: Why Not to Joint Venture with Chinese State Companies

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Lessons Learned: Why Not to Joint Venture with Chinese State Companies

    Kawasaki Siemens Alstom all where very eager to partake in the Chinese Rail development.

    China had nothing to offer technologically.

    So after a few initial batches of trains bought from foreign manufacturers China pressed companies into JV transferring all technology to the Chinese partners.

    Already in the second round of railway modernisation Western manufacturers got shut out and where downgraded to sub-suppliers.


    China now presents the CRH380 (A/B) series as an indigenous development as they allegedly changed their designs so much that it can be considered developed independently.

    Both versions A and B are based on Alstom-Siemens and Kawasaki designs.


    http://www.manager-magazin.de/untern...a-1036216.html

  • #2
    You got it all backwards, China's CRH380 is an indigenous development hence it is safer and faster :-). It is the Kawasaki that is alleging things. Apple and Samsung go at it all the time, and sometimes they sue. Where is Kawasaki's lawsuit? What? They didn't even try? Is that why China can even export this train? I rest my case.

    I think you are just mad that China has world's largest highspeed railway system. Pulling out a 2015 article that is in German says it all.

    Comment


    • #3
      Yes, everyone knows that everyone else copies China. China's engineers are best engineers in whole world. Not copy. Just look alike. China thought of first. Western sneaky capitalists secretly copied China thoughts before China could produce. Tricky capitalists.

      Comment


      • #4
        Just like how "everyone" knew that Iraq had weapon of mass destruction? Watching the following video really made me laugh. Just watch how hard the female anchor tried to force the word "theft" out of Qualcomm's CEO, but all he said were "partnership". Why gave this video the title "...China and intellectual property theft..?" when not a word of that was discussed? If the title of this video were "China partnership", no one would be able to tell it had anything to do with intellectual property theft.

        Last edited by pla; 20-09-2018, 01:20 PM.

        Comment


        • #5
          He is a profiteur these kind of people are mostly responsible for the loss of business cases.


          What I am mad about is the incompetence and shortsightedness of exactly these manager types.

          The train issue stopped in 2015, after that they sold nothing so what was there to report?

          I am mad at the stupidity of extremely high paid fools getting tricked like a 3 year old.


          With cars you still have teh consumer who can decide what to buy so a JV is bad but not devastating.

          What did they think to work that close with STATE OWNED COMPANIES WORKING FOR A STATE DOMINATED MARKET SECTOR.


          You only can lose there.

          Comment


          • #6
            Maybe Trumps right

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by picanha View Post
              He is a profiteur these kind of people are mostly responsible for the loss of business cases.


              What I am mad about is the incompetence and shortsightedness of exactly these manager types.

              The train issue stopped in 2015, after that they sold nothing so what was there to report?

              I am mad at the stupidity of extremely high paid fools getting tricked like a 3 year old.


              With cars you still have teh consumer who can decide what to buy so a JV is bad but not devastating.

              What did they think to work that close with STATE OWNED COMPANIES WORKING FOR A STATE DOMINATED MARKET SECTOR.


              You only can lose there.
              Do you get mad when low paid fools get tricked? Who do you think get tricked more often? The rich or poor?

              Anyway, China didn't shut out German or Japanese companies. Why would Chinese public money buy more expensive and LOWER quality foreign trains? Chinese trains are cheaper and better. Chinese high speed train was chosen by the Americans, but American government shut it out. Some American cities are buying Chinese trains, but China has to build tbese trains in America. When German tax money buys Chinese trains, then we talk. I don't expect Germans to use tax money to buy Chinese trains, so why are you asking China to? German cars are already dominating the Chinese car market, so don't be too greedy. You guys are making good money in China. Also, Germany is way too dependent on trade, you guys should start to reduce that dependence. China can put up a fight with America because China has been reducing its dependence on trade for at least a decade. Its dependence on trade is now below global average. Thanks to Trump, it will be reduced even further.

              Comment


              • #8
                How Chinese can have better quality trains if they lack same technological capacity and expertise that industrial powerhouse like Germany posses? What about Siemens? Their products are bench when it comes to quality or so it's been said by their customers.
                So far I only read bad things about Chinese trains and their components, supposedly very high levels of components not meeting safety standards. Hence decreased speed of bullet trains due to wear and tear. But maybe I am wrong, China is advancing fast.

                Comment


                • #9
                  They improved their quality through. Because they learned how to do it. Siemens alone had a thousand Chinese rolling stock technicians in Munich for training.

                  They gave and showed them everything, the CRH Serie is derived from Siemens and Kawasaki Designs. They just went from ther on. Much easier and simpler.
                  Last edited by picanha; 23-09-2018, 11:06 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by KaliOS View Post
                    How Chinese can have better quality trains if they lack same technological capacity and expertise that industrial powerhouse like Germany posses? What about Siemens? Their products are bench when it comes to quality or so it's been said by their customers.
                    So far I only read bad things about Chinese trains and their components, supposedly very high levels of components not meeting safety standards. Hence decreased speed of bullet trains due to wear and tear. But maybe I am wrong, China is advancing fast.
                    Well, no one is denying that Germany is an industrial powerhouse. But that doesn't mean that Germany is good at everything. Germany is very good at certain things, but not at everything. Do you see German cell phones? America is also an industrial powerhouse, but do you see any good high speed trains made by Americans?

                    China has only ONE fatal high speed train incident that was caused by mismanagement rather than the train itself. Even the super safe Japanese trains had a fatal incident that killed more people. Other than that China is running world's largest high speed rail, in every imaginable terrains (deserts, wetland, mountains, depressions, etc...), with a very good record in terms of safety and on-time performance. So I am not sure what "not meeting safety standards" you were referring to?

                    If you "only" read bad things about Chinese trains, not a single good thing, then don't you have a problem in whatever country you live in?

                    Last edited by pla; 21-09-2018, 08:48 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by pla View Post

                      Well, no one is denying that Germany is an industrial powerhouse. But that doesn't mean that Germany is good at everything. Germany is very good at certain things, but not at everything. Do you see German cell phones? America is also an industrial powerhouse, but do you see any good high speed trains made by Americans?

                      China has only ONE fatal high speed train incident that was caused by mismanagement rather than the train itself. Even the super safe Japanese trains had a fatal incident that killed more people. Other than that China is running world's largest high speed rail, in every imaginable terrains (deserts, wetland, mountains, depressions, etc...), with a very good record in terms of safety and on-time performance. So I am not sure what "not meeting safety standards" you were referring to?

                      If you "only" read bad things about Chinese trains, not a single good thing, then don't you have a problem in whatever country you live in?
                      Thanks for the answer. Press I read is either sinophile or sinophobe. No middle ground.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by KaliOS View Post

                        Thanks for the answer. Press I read is either sinophile or sinophobe. No middle ground.
                        I see, thank you for seeking out the truth in such a tough press environment.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          We have the world biggest exporter of dairy.
                          Now it used to and still does develope markets for its products....Russia(CCCP) , Sri Lanka, Indonesia , Vietnam, Cuba, Eritrea , Sudan the picture is all over the place in some really hairy places. Now in China they have invested hmmm half a billion in two failed JVs

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by primer View Post
                            We have the world biggest exporter of dairy.
                            Now it used to and still does develope markets for its products....Russia(CCCP) , Sri Lanka, Indonesia , Vietnam, Cuba, Eritrea , Sudan the picture is all over the place in some really hairy places. Now in China they have invested hmmm half a billion in two failed JVs
                            What? 25% of New Zealand's dairy export goes to China compared to less than 5% goes to America. You are still unhappy?

                            Number from your own government: https://www.stats.govt.nz/news/new-z...ver-the-decade

                            New Zealand had a $3.6 billion goods and services trade surplus with China for the December 2017 year. This means that New Zealand earned more from our goods and services exports to China than we spent on our imports from China.

                            The main contributor to the trade surplus was the increase in exports of milk powder, butter, and cheese to China – which was up $1.4 billion (52 percent) in 2017 to $4.1 billion. In 2017 New Zealand had its highest level of dairy product exports to China since the record-high dairy prices of 2013/14. This increased our overall trade surplus with China to the highest level since 2014.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Have no idea what your reply is in context other than China still sucks at commerce

                              Hows the trade war going?

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X