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  • #31
    Originally posted by flamming_python View Post
    Estonia's former president said as much so himself just a week ago, when he dismissed this whole notion and made provocative remarks about Russian cities being wiped off the map if Russia dared anything (don't remember Russia making threats to annihilate Tallinn).
    Of course he didn't, you slandering little python. He just said that he doesn't believe Russian military aggression towards Estonia to be likely, because even they know that an attack against a NATO member might have reprecussions like "losing Omsk and Tomsk and certainly St.Petersburg". And then there's Russian officials that say that certain missiles will have new co-ordinates for any country that decides to join Nato. Which is totally ok I suppose.

    Just put ice where it hurts.

    Originally posted by Musashi View Post
    That's far too stronK. Somebody should tell him to STFU and stop saying something that is beyond his powers.
    You can read about the interview here: https://www.eurointegration.com.ua/r.../06/4/7082481/ , use Google translate if needed. No surprise, the whole atmosphere of the interview is different.
    Last edited by drax; 09-06-2018, 01:36 PM. Reason: another quote added

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by ATSzmrots View Post
      So much Russian butthurt here!
      More like amusement over Polish irrationality and inability to learn. You, basically, repeat all you did wrong with Brits and the French century earlier. Neither served you any good. 50 years more and you'll switch to Chinese skirt, and who knows what next, Brasil maybe or independent Mars. But the core of your trouble with neighbors will remain. The thing is, you either have to reconsider your ambitions and keep low profile, or build up your own military, industry, union and so on, and rely only on yourself. Now you just like the picture with dogs above, except the owner is heartless (as nations, being abstract construct, has no filings at all) and won't miss you eaten. What worrisome (for your health), is that you don't consider this wrong and continue to fight the effect instead of dealing with the cause which is your inadequate self-evaluation.


      Originally posted by Musashi View Post
      Please accuse Japan and Norway, one of the least corrupt countries in the world, of corruption, as they donate a shitload of money to maintain the U.S. troops on their territories as well. Be sure, our readers will take your words as very reliable ones
      I told you, Japan is an occupied country. They will pay even if Americans will pack up and leave.
      Don't know anything about Norway, except this strangely named volcano eruption and helmets with horns. Do they still wear them?

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Akril View Post

        More like amusement over Polish irrationality and inability to learn. You, basically, repeat all you did wrong with Brits and the French century earlier.
        What did we do wrong? Was it Poland's fault? As I have already told you, we don't trust any European NATO allies, that's why we don't want to rely on them as a major supporter. That's the lesson learned from the past. If you read the official polls regarding their stance on supporting their allies, all of them, except for the British, don't give a flying fuck about it. That's what we had known a very long time ago and no polls were necessary for that. However, if the members living in Western European countries see this poll, they should fully understand why Poland needs American bases.
        http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank..._16-7-6-nato4/
        Originally posted by Akril View Post
        Neither served you any good. 50 years more and you'll switch to Chinese skirt, and who knows what next, Brasil maybe or independent Mars.
        If you knew us better, you'd realise we are not famous for changing our alliances. Let me remind you the story of Napoleon. Almost all, if not all, foreign troops abandoned him in the last stage of his rule, but the Poles have never done it. They were the people saving his ass when he nearly drowned while crossing the Berezina River and for the second time when the Poles covered his retreat during the battle of Leipzig, suffering 75% of losses under that process.

        Originally posted by Akril View Post
        But the core of your trouble with neighbors will remain. The thing is, you either have to reconsider your ambitions and keep
        low profile, or build up your own military, industry, union and so on, and rely only on yourself.
        We are who we are and we will never change. We don't expect you to change either.

        Originally posted by Akril View Post
        Now you just like the picture with dogs above, except the owner is heartless (as nations, being

        abstract construct, has no filings at all) and won't miss you eaten.
        As the owner has no "filings", did you order to kill him and stuff him? Did you use some sand or cotton wool?

        Originally posted by Akril View Post
        What worrisome (for your health), is that you don't consider this wrong and continue to fight the effect instead of dealing with the cause which is your inadequate self-evaluation.
        Our self-evaluation is OK.

        Originally posted by Akril View Post
        I told you, Japan is an occupied country. They will pay even if Americans will pack up and leave.
        Poland was a territory occupied by the Soviet troops and I don't remember us paying them. Your logic is purely flawed. Does Ukraine help Russia maintain the Russian troops deployed in Crimea?
        Originally posted by Akril View Post
        Don't know anything about Norway, except this strangely named volcano eruption and helmets with horns. Do they still wear them?
        You should brush up your knowledge then. It's a shame you know nothing about impressive countries and it's even worse when that particular country is your neighbour. A clever person tries to hide their shortcomings and is ashamed of admitting them.
        The Norwegians are intelligent people:
        https://iq-research.info/en/average-iq-by-country
        When it comes to corruption, maybe you should look elsewhere. Compare the positions of Norway and Russia in this table:
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corrup...ceptions_Index
        Poland is not on the top, but it's still higher by 102 positions. None of our ex-commie buddies, who became democracies at the end of the 80s, are anywhere close to us.
        Last edited by Musashi; 10-06-2018, 08:05 AM.

        Comment


        • #34
          i dont understand why poland / poles has / have to bash europe on every occasion or making fun of europe's troubles, i mean why fronting on europe all the time ?

          Poland: The high price of emigration

          Thousands of Polish nurses, caregivers and workmen leave the country for employment. That has consequences: Many Polish children grow up without parents, who are gone for months or even years at a time.

          Polish internet sites are full of stories from children who feel abandoned by their parents because they are working abroad. They look for support on internet forums where they write about their fate: "Hi Dad, I'm already 16. It has been a year since you left. Every day I smell the shirt you left behind because it didn't fit in your suitcase. It reminds me of you," as Maria quotes from a letter she wrote to her father who is in England working as a day laborer. Tomek, an 18-year-old, complains: "My mom went abroad when I was 13. She said she was going to Germany for a couple of months because she made so little in Poland. She couldn't even afford to buy clothes here. She is still there. That makes me sad."

          Polish health-care system on life support

          Teresa worked in hospitals in western Poland for 15 years. When her children were aged 14 and 15 she began traveling to Germany for work. At that point, her marriage was already over because her husband had found someone else in England, where he was working as a laborer. Her teenage children lived with her parents, and things were not going well there, either.

          She was shocked when she went back to her old hospital. Most of her colleagues had left the country and were working in England, Germany or Norway. "Several wards were deserted; others were so full that patients were forced to stay in the hallways. We had so much work that I was constantly having to decide whether I should feed one patient or take another to the bathroom. And if, who first? It was humiliating, both for me and for the patients," says Teresa.

          The social costs of emigration

          Since Poland joined the EU in 2004, some 20,000 trained nurses have left the country, mainly to work as caregivers. Today there are 280,000 nurses in Poland; only 42,000 of them are under the age of 40. The average age is 51. In 2015, Poland had 5.2 nurses and 2.3 doctors per 1,000 citizens (in Germany, the ratios are 13 and 4.1 to 1,000). The country's health-care system is chronically underfunded. It thus comes as no surprise that ever more personnel consider leaving. The social costs of that situation, however, are massive.

          Yet the 55-year-old has no choice but to commute because she has to support her aging parents and pay for her children's education. She is not happy about it but she doesn't see how she could manage if she stayed in Poland.


          @deutschewelle

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by heiliger_geist View Post
            i dont understand why poland / poles has / have to bash europe on every occasion or making fun of europe's troubles, i mean why fronting on europe all the time ?
            What do you mean? Can you read English and did you read the poll from my link? If you still don't understand our attitude, you should improve your comprehension skills.
            http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank..._16-7-6-nato4/
            What else do you want? Do you mean our attitude towards so-called refugees? It's a no-brainer that we will never be interested in taking scores of uneducated, unemployable, welfare-loving troublemakers from shithole countries, as we are not obliged to do it. The present government wants to take a lot of Vietnamese and Pinoys and I totally don't mind it. After all, they are not famous for living off welfare or planting bombs in your neighbourhood. There are people like Smokey on this forum, who would not like to see any foreigners in Poland, but I don't have such a problem.

            Originally posted by heiliger_geist View Post
            Poland: The high price of emigration
            I'm assuming you are a German citizen with Turkish roots, so I can tell you Turkey's price of immigration is not so high. Turkish people living in Germany are significantly less educated and less employable not only than ethnic Germans but Turks in Turkey as well. Do you want to discuss it?

            Comment


            • #36
              thing is, i would never bash germany. and those who do should think twice. and turkey is not even eu-member.

              thats why im amazed about the hate some poles have when it comes to europe especially germany.. while getting some cheese from the eu-budget,.. or even the chance to get some proper cash for their contribution here..

              and then you said, some european nato members dont care about poland, i guess thats the reason why you enjoy the european refugees crisis.. probably to show off and make people believe that poland is a true role model for europe.. some sort of a saviour.. well, i believe that this all is done to promote acceptance. to get accepted.

              poland's stance regarding the refugees might be the right thing, ill give you that..

              but you sure aint a european saviour.. because money talks, money saves.. look at greece.

              therefore im baffled how easily one would sell a union that feeds all its members including poland, just because it doesnt nuke russia.

              2 billions for the muricans instead of a proper health-care investment, think of me as a polish dude asking you this question, a healthy discussion. do you think the fear regarding russia is exaggerated?

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by heiliger_geist View Post
                thing is, i would never bash germany. and those who do should think twice. and turkey is not even eu-member.
                Providing the link to the official poll is not bashing.
                Originally posted by heiliger_geist View Post
                thats why im amazed about the hate some poles have when it comes to europe especially germany.. while getting some cheese from the eu-budget,.. or even the chance to get some proper cash for their contribution here..
                I don't hate Germany. It looks like you confused me with Smokey. I had been living 15 km from the German border for 30+ years and I don't have any negative experiences with Germans. I used to trade with Germans and my impression was, the number of good/bad people in Poland and Germany is roughly the same. I am quite proficient in German and I like using Gerlish on this forum, as you may have noticed
                The lack of trust is not hatred, so don't confuse these two things. If German people say they are not interested in helping their allies, what do you expect me to think about it?
                Originally posted by heiliger_geist View Post
                and then you said, some european nato members dont care about poland, i guess thats the reason why you enjoy the european refugees crisis.. probably to show off and make people believe that poland is a true role model for europe.. some sort of a saviour.. well, i believe that this all is done to promote acceptance. to get accepted.
                You should have noticed that I'm a staunch opponent of the present Polish government. National socialism is not a funny thing, no matter if it's implemented in Poland, Germany or Burkina Faso. The idiotic EU stance towards Poland and Polish people's attitude towards taking the scores of troublemakers, described for fun as refugees, brought national socialists to power. It was not the only factor, but it helped them significantly.

                Originally posted by heiliger_geist View Post
                poland's stance regarding the refugees might be the right thing, ill give you that..
                Thanks.
                Originally posted by heiliger_geist View Post
                [...]but you sure aint a european saviour.. because money talks, money saves.. look at greece.
                I've never said Poland is Europe's saviour.
                Originally posted by heiliger_geist View Post
                therefore im baffled how easily one would sell a union that feeds all its members including poland, just because it doesnt nuke russia.
                Most Poles are not interested in nuking Russia and we would not be even if Poland and Russia swapped their places as military powers (like Poland having nukes and Russia not having them).
                Originally posted by heiliger_geist View Post
                2 billions for the muricans instead of a proper health-care investment, think of me as a polish dude asking you this question, a healthy discussion. do you think the fear regarding russia is exaggerated?
                I haven't stated that I'm a big fan of spending so much money. I've clearly said we have more important issues to be dealt with. Read my posts above.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Poles believe that someone is going to die for their sovereignity.
                  Why would anyone from Europe never mind from US die for you ?
                  What's there in Poland to warrant such optimism?

                  Not trying to have dig at Poland or it's citizens I'm just failing to understand it.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Kriva View Post
                    Poles believe that someone is going to die for their sovereignity.
                    Why would anyone from Europe never mind from US die for you ?
                    What's there in Poland to warrant such optimism?
                    Not trying to have dig at Poland or it's citizens I'm just failing to understand it.
                    The world must be quite a mysterious place for you. How many wars in the last 100 years has the US fought on it's own soil? When you look it up then perhaps you would agree that throughout history some sort of Reasons must exist for one power to aid another in time of troubles.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Musashi View Post
                      What did we do wrong? Was it Poland's fault? As I have already told you, we don't trust any European NATO allies, that's why we don't want to rely on them as a major supporter. That's the lesson learned from the past. If you read the official polls regarding their stance on supporting their allies, all of them, except for the British, don't give a flying fuck about it. That's what we had known a very long time ago and no polls were necessary for that. However, if the members living in Western European countries see this poll, they should fully understand why Poland needs American bases.
                      http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank..._16-7-6-nato4/

                      If you knew us better, you'd realise we are not famous for changing our alliances. Let me remind you the story of Napoleon. Almost all, if not all, foreign troops abandoned him in the last stage of his rule, but the Poles have never done it. They were the people saving his ass when he nearly drowned while crossing the Berezina River and for the second time when the Poles covered his retreat during the battle of Leipzig, suffering 75% of losses under that process.


                      We are who we are and we will never change. We don't expect you to change either.


                      As the owner has no "filings", did you order to kill him and stuff him? Did you use some sand or cotton wool?


                      Our self-evaluation is OK.


                      Poland was a territory occupied by the Soviet troops and I don't remember us paying them. Your logic is purely flawed. Does Ukraine help Russia maintain the Russian troops deployed in Crimea?

                      You should brush up your knowledge then. It's a shame you know nothing about impressive countries and it's even worse when that particular country is your neighbour. A clever person tries to hide their shortcomings and is ashamed of admitting them.
                      The Norwegians are intelligent people:
                      https://iq-research.info/en/average-iq-by-country
                      When it comes to corruption, maybe you should look elsewhere. Compare the positions of Norway and Russia in this table:
                      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corrup...ceptions_Index
                      Poland is not on the top, but it's still higher by 102 positions. None of our ex-commie buddies, who became democracies at the end of the 80s, are anywhere close to us.
                      Hello - Earth to butthurt land

                      Russia is not threatening Poland

                      Every problem you have with us, is one that your politicians knowingly provoked themselves, trampling over Russian security concerns in its nuclear deterrence capabilities, Ukraine and everywhere they could - so as for said Polish Pany to then be able to stride out onto the podium to throw up their hands in front of the gullible masses and say "thems the bad guys!!".

                      But even then, nothing has moved beyond any rhetoric, and said rhetoric is tame too.

                      So sit down, have a glass of orange juice, swallow a couple of pills, and relax about this reds under the bed shit.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by flamming_python View Post

                        Hello - Earth to butthurt land

                        Russia is not threatening Poland

                        Every problem you have with us, is one that your politicians knowingly provoked themselves, trampling over Russian security concerns in its nuclear deterrence capabilities, Ukraine and everywhere they could - so as for said Polish Pany to then be able to stride out onto the podium to throw up their hands in front of the gullible masses and say "thems the bad guys!!".

                        But even then, nothing has moved beyond any rhetoric, and said rhetoric is tame too.

                        So sit down, have a glass of orange juice, swallow a couple of pills, and relax about this reds under the bed shit.
                        Are you telling me that I'm butthurt? Poland didn't want to trample anything. We have already had a couple of topics about the ABM shield. First, Russian members were butthurt and then they claimed that "our ├╝bermodern and stronk ICBMs will defeat your pathetic ABM shield xaxaxa".
                        Russia is not going to lob any ICBMs over Poland in order to attack the U.S.A. The primary route would be over the North Pole or the Pacific. Apart from that, a couple of interceptors would not change anything if hundreds of ICBMs were lobbed. That's why the famous Soviet officer dismissed a fake trace of a single ICBM as a BS. Luckily, he was clever and competent, so he prevented the WW3.
                        Regarding the ABM shield, it was the only kind of an American base the Yanks offered back then. We could have been happier if they had deployed an armoured division, but they didn't want it. However, after the first Anschlu├č of the 21st century, many more options appeared and permanent bases for U.S. land forces may be built as well.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Musashi View Post
                          Most Poles are not interested in nuking Russia and we would not be even if Poland and Russia swapped their places as military powers (like Poland having nukes and Russia not having them).
                          Just saw this gem

                          Oh, right, so most Poles wouldn't nuke Russia even if you had nukes

                          The magnamity of it all.
                          The honour!
                          Thank you oh Poles, there is much to learn from you and your ways, how can we ever repay you for your lessons in life.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by flamming_python View Post

                            Just saw this gem

                            Oh, right, so most Poles wouldn't nuke Russia even if you had nukes

                            The magnamity of it all.
                            The honour!
                            Thank you oh Poles, there is much to learn from you and your ways, how can we ever repay you for your lessons in life.
                            Of course, there would not be any point in nuking Russia even if Russia was as powerful as some banana republic. Does it make any sense do destroy Europe's petrol station? Trade between the EU and Russia is still big, so nuking Russia would stop the trade and resource supplies. Let's say, Germany, who is Poland's the biggest trade partner, wouldn't be able to import as much fron Poland due to selling fewer products in Russia and having supplies cut off. I can say the same about other EU countries.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Musashi View Post
                              Of course, there would not be any point in nuking Russia even if Russia was as powerful as some banana republic. Does it make any sense do destroy Europe's petrol station? Trade between the EU and Russia is still big, so nuking Russia would stop the trade and resource supplies. Let's say, Germany, who is Poland's the biggest trade partner, wouldn't be able to import as much fron Poland due to selling fewer products in Russia and having supplies cut off. I can say the same about other EU countries.
                              Why are you even mentioning it then?

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Miller2 View Post
                                No, IMHO their end/long term goal is to get access to the weapons of mass destruction.
                                Well in this case it's worth withdrawing from Non-prolifiration Treaty first which Poland is signatory of. But even then there is no chance for Poles to get nuclear weapons because they don't possess and won't possess technologies capable of enriching uranium or purifying plutonium let alone all uranium supplies are controlled by IAEA.

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