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Trump doubles down: 'Trade wars are good, and easy to win'

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  • Originally posted by primer View Post
    Musk added that American companies that ship their cars to China pay a significantly larger import duty than Chinese cars that come to the U.S.
    For example, an American car going to China pays 25% import duty, but a Chinese car coming to the US only pays 2.5%, a tenfold difference," Musk tweeted

    Its pretty simple. EU hiding behind its massive VAT, Tax free addresses in EU countries or Canada and its obvious Aluminum subsidies. So far non of the background for discourse gets much attention ...its just the usual alarm.

    Trumps already using his options. He knows full well this will end up in WTO arbitration anyway. So that will have evidential proof to support increasing tariffs which is perfectly legitimate on countries that subsidize or have equal tarrifs. Thats fair trade.

    NAFTA is being negotiated.

    There is no horror story here.
    Maybe if china matched the US 2.5% tariff even more American cars would sell in china . It does not seem very fair that Chinese companies have been allowed low tariffs to compete against US companies in US market but then the favour is not returned . China may say we ve no need for American products but due to restrictive tax policies American companies have never had a chance to sell its products .

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    • It didn't stop at tariffs. The marketing even the offloading in port hassles are huge. A very inverted country for doing business. Even big companies struggle with these surcharges and Chinese partners.
      Lots of cost duplicating going on. Lots of extras to pay.

      They have high freight costs for such relatively a low labour cost country.

      25% tariff on that "booming" export figure will be grateful appreciated PLA

      Monsanto boss recently said that Trump on trade has helped his company's leverage overseas.

      Aussie was threatened with the steel tarrif then benevolently given a pass. Even his tweets shift the world stock prices.
      Last edited by primer; 10-03-2018, 07:51 AM.

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      • Originally posted by primer View Post
        Uncompetitive.
        Does it really matter whether or not China is uncompetitive? It didn't stop China to have "the fastest sustained expansion by a major economy in history." http://www.worldbank.org/en/country/china/overview You can whine about China all you want :-) Trump's tariff is not going to do anything to the Chinese trade. What you call "unfair" protectionism worked for China. But it doesn't work for US. That's the bottomline. It is not that US is charitable giving away its dollars to Chinese and others. After some years, China's "unfair" protectionism will no longer work for China, either. This is why China has been getting ready for it. US should always look after its own interests. If tariff is indeed in America's interest, then do it.

        By the way, China remained as New Zealand's top trading partner in 2017. The trade has been good, and is getting better. You are welcome: http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/201..._136936723.htm
        https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/101...rading-partner
        Last edited by pla; 10-03-2018, 11:57 AM.

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        • That is why they are doing it.

          No whining, feel more like pity for those that try and do business in China. But good luck to those that succeed... PLA its a long journey like Caine walking the earth searching for a reason..

          You have these health hang ups?
          NZ has just what you need to fix those. No problem you can buy the factory with full vertical integration...yes lock stock and full barrel.

          NZ Politian's have a deep feelings reciprocity when it comes to secret handshakes and life after politics on boards of Chinese investment banks.

          Aussie has cranked down on that kind of political meddling though...those Aussies aye mate.

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          • Update PLA. A Kiwi well be revising your US tarrifs. heheehhe

            http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world/...c-advisor.html

            Its is pure irony coming from the land that really was the first inductee into globalism.
            Last edited by primer; 12-03-2018, 09:46 AM.

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            • Originally posted by primer View Post
              Update PLA. A Kiwi well be revising your US tarrifs. heheehhe

              http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world/...c-advisor.html

              Its is pure irony coming from the land that really was the first inductee into globalism.
              It is not a zero-sum game. Hope a Kiwi will serve America's interest right. A good government should always look after its nation's interests. Smart tariff is the way to go. Stupid tariff, like the recent Trump one, well..., is just stupid.

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              • https://www.theguardian.com/business...-steel-tariffs

                Australia will not join any EU complaint to WTO over steel tariffs ....Trump using his buying power.

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                • Originally posted by primer View Post
                  https://www.theguardian.com/business...-steel-tariffs

                  Australia will not join any EU complaint to WTO over steel tariffs ....Trump using his buying power.

                  This tariff is just comical. Australia exports less steel to America than India. This tariff would, at best, have no effect if it is not imposed on all countries. At worst, it could put a dent on US's economy. So this is simply a show for the Trump supporters, to create this perception that Trump is tough on international trade. Nothing else. Mark my words, US trade deficit will NOT change much in 2018. It has the potential to set another record high. Why? because US trade is largely driven by market force, not some "strong man" in the white house.

                  Speaking of "buying power," Australia exports 8 times more to China than to America, and this export to China is still growing...
                  Last edited by pla; 13-03-2018, 12:50 PM.

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                  • The political nuance read clear in Aussie news.

                    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-s...-idUSKBN1ES0QQ

                    How very GM of them almost like China
                    Last edited by primer; 13-03-2018, 11:51 AM.

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                    • If the price point of the end product is too high then the manufacturer will have to absorb it or loose sales because US has competitive factories.
                      Foreign assembly in US has been going on for years already. Even hand assembly like rifle scopes for example.

                      Steel and Aluminum are a side story though. A component. Manufacturing it into a product is the real cost. A shift in currency has a bigger effect. Which happens so frequently but is hardly ever considered.

                      Yearly productivity of a US worker is well over $100K

                      600 billion proposed tariff figure for Chinese imports mentioned. So they have been working on this for a while. Tillerson gone so that the last of the Wall Street firsters

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                      • Originally posted by primer View Post
                        If the price point of the end product is too high then the manufacturer will have to absorb it or loose sales because US has competitive factories.
                        Foreign assembly in US has been going on for years already. Even hand assembly like rifle scopes for example.

                        Steel and Aluminum are a side story though. A component. Manufacturing it into a product is the real cost. A shift in currency has a bigger effect. Which happens so frequently but is hardly ever considered.

                        Yearly productivity of a US worker is well over $100K

                        600 billion proposed tariff figure for Chinese imports mentioned. So they have been working on this for a while. Tillerson gone so that the last of the Wall Street firsters
                        I think you got too excited.

                        Anyway, China can stomach $60 billion easily. Just look at the historic numbers: https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ance-of-china/ $60 billion falls and ups were common. China was doing just fine whenever the trade surplus dropped. China's 2017 trade surplus was $87 billion less than 2016, but its economy grew faster in 2017 than in 2016.

                        China's trade to GDP ratio has been getting smaller and smaller by the year, so China's growth is not dependent on trade with US. China's trade to GDP ratio is below global average, and is lower than many major economies in the world. For example, India, Italy, Canada, UK, Germany, Russia, South Korea, New Zealand, Australia, etc...

                        https://data.worldbank.org/indicator...DE-KR-NZ-1W-RU

                        So please try make America great again by artificially change international trade. Just more motivation for China to fasten the transformation of its economy. China plays the long game, and has the political will. Does America?
                        Last edited by pla; 13-03-2018, 08:02 PM.

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                        • http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-03-1...-real-/9531176

                          Nor is the estimated $US600 billion the US is said to be missing out on through its bright ideas being appropriated illegally offshore
                          The so-called Section 301 law is the mother of all trade weapons built in the Cold War and vastly more protectionist era of the 1970s.

                          It gives the president the authority to unleash unilateral measures on a trading partner, if it is deemed to be harming US business interests.

                          It is a cluster bomb of measures including outright trade sanctions, import quotas, tariffs, blocked take-over provisions and anything else that could be dreamed up to damage the target's economy.

                          It also allows the US to sidestep many of the niceties of World Trade Organisation rulings on such things.

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                          • Below are also from the same article you quoted:

                            Recent reports out of the US suggest Section 301 will be initially dropped on the $US130 billion worth of electrical goods China ships to the US each year.
                            While taxing what are effectively steel off-cuts from the smoky, old Chinese industrial complex could probably be ignored in Beijing, not so an attack on China's vision for a high-tech, high-margin, low-polluting future.

                            It would inevitably provoke retaliation, with US farmers likely to be the immediate collateral damage.

                            Soon you would have not only excess steel and aluminium washing around the world's trade routes looking a shore to wash up on, you can add all manner of grains and agricultural produce as well.

                            Pretty soon prices tumble and everyone piles in throwing up more trade barriers.

                            Once those sorts of huge distortions are put into the $850 billion worth of goods traded between China and the US each year, who knows what the outcome would be on everyone else.

                            One of the few certainties in such a situation is Australia, with its small domestic market, its heavy reliance on being a price-taker in commodity exports and no leverage in such battles, would get absolutely hammered
                            Also, the so-called "$US130 billion worth of electrical goods" are mostly made for non-Chinese companies like Sony, Samsung, Apple, Dell, Panasonic, etc...While most of an iPhone's profit goes to Apple, the full cost of an iphone is counted in the "$US130 billion" of Chinese goods. The real Chinese brand electrical goods are already being sanctioned by the US, so more tariffs on them wouldn't make any difference. Chinese companies have already given up on the American market anyway. This is why China is so eager to help develop other poorer developing countries. They are the future, not US, a declining insecure empire.

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                            • It'll all help fill the company tax shortfall. Every little bit counts and look at it as payback.

                              Kudlow got the job. No fan of China but more even toward fair trade partners.

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                              • Originally posted by primer View Post
                                It'll all help fill the company tax shortfall. Every little bit counts and look at it as payback.

                                Kudlow got the job. No fan of China but more even toward fair trade partners.
                                hahaha! spend $1 million of American A's money to save $100,000 for American B. Yup, I am looking at the payback...At the end, America loses $900,000. keep up the good work!

                                China is trying to cut back on manufacturing, so we thank Trump for the catalyst.
                                China is also trying to cut back on investment overseas, so we thank Trump for restrictions on Chinese investments in US.
                                Fewer American paper dollars in the already huge Chinese dollar reserve? Well, China just spend a little less when buying American debt. What is all that paper money going to do for China anyway? fewer the better...
                                Last edited by pla; 14-03-2018, 11:32 AM.

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