Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Brexit thread

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Sniffit View Post

    To be fair to Verhofstadt, the Greeks and other sourhern Europeans would probably benefit from surrendering some sovereignty to the north 😂
    they do - we invade them every summer

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Sniffit View Post

      To be fair to Verhofstadt, the Greeks and other sourhern Europeans would probably benefit from surrendering some sovereignty to the north 😂
      We have an expression around here that goes "don't catch the football". If you don't take responsibility for them, you're not responsible for them. Don't catch the football.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Sniffit View Post

        To be fair to Verhofstadt, the Greeks and other sourhern Europeans would probably benefit from surrendering some sovereignty to the north 😂
        That's your problem , right there . That attitude of superiority of one nation over another .

        Comment


        • 4. Again, as I understand it, to roll all the EU laws we have accumulated over the past 40 years into UK Law requires about 400 of things called Statutory Instruments, or 28 a day in the time available. There was some doubt over this being achieved but that seems to have dissipated as on one day 36 went through and they are well on target.
          Issue is not limited to regulations/laws
          That is the simpliest part as most of those already existing are implemented into UK market for years now

          Issue is wider and impacts trade agreements (EU trade agreements are valid as long as you are in the EU, once a separate country, you'll have to negociate alone partner by partner.....)

          Issue is about certifications (when your certification companies are in EU, this is making things more complicated if there is no more free circulation of goods and files .... and this is going both ways, there are certification companies in UK for EU goods. Legally once brexited, those certifications have not any value anymore for the EU market)

          Issue is about circulation of goods for multi sourced goods. If some parts of your engine are swedish, french and german and you have to set up regulation for each of the three partners (insteade of a single common regulation) to have them UK compatible, if each time, for each partner you have border paperwork, if each time, your tabletime schedule is bottlenecked by increased administrative work because you are not part of a common market anymore, the cost will rise both for internal consumption and export

          Issue is about validation for the EU market of UK produced goods. Even if you have EU compatible regulations, given that you would be outside the market, your exported good will have to be checked and controled by EU certification agencies like any extra EU commercial partner (say China or Japan). It takes time, paperwork, i.e money. And again, it has an impact on the cost and availability of the goods

          It is not so much a matter of direct cost but all indirect costs that will increase and make your products less competitive unless heavily subsidized

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Mordoror View Post

            ...

            Issue is about certifications (when your certification companies are in EU, this is making things more complicated if there is no more free circulation of goods and files .... and this is going both ways, there are certification companies in UK for EU goods. Legally once brexited, those certifications have not any value anymore for the EU market)

            Issue is about circulation of goods for multi sourced goods. If some parts of your engine are swedish, french and german and you have to set up regulation for each of the three partners (insteade of a single common regulation) to have them UK compatible, if each time, for each partner you have border paperwork, if each time, your tabletime schedule is bottlenecked by increased administrative work because you are not part of a common market anymore, the cost will rise both for internal consumption and export
            ...
            From what I have read, the UK will not issue in any short term its own certification system. For all products it will accept without further testing any product food or industry from the EU. The UK plans to abide to any change of regulation the EU decides, and even wishes to pay to be part of the agencies without a right to vote. As JohninMK wrote, the UK has decided to keep the flow on its side totally fluid.

            There is a question here however: is the UK allowed not to claim any duties on a zone it is not member of, but claim duties on other countries for their imports. I am no expert in international trade, but I have a feeling that without a free trade agreement, you can´t decide that imports from some countries are at 0 while equivalent imports from other countries are not.


            Comment


            • From what I have read, the UK will not issue in any short term its own certification system. For all products it will accept without further testing any product food or industry from the EU. The UK plans to abide to any change of regulation the EU decides, and even wishes to pay to be part of the agencies without a right to vote. As JohninMK wrote, the UK has decided to keep the flow on its side totally fluid.
              I have understood that but the issue goes beyond this because it is opening a legal clusterfuck
              In both ways


              I have an example in mind : the world leader of ropes (BEAL) is french but its certification agency is in UK. The certification is EU compliant. But if UK leaves, even if EU compliant, the ropes won't be certified legally and this will happen overnight. Technically they will be OK but not administratively

              Comment


              • Originally posted by bfc1001 View Post
                Ok , let's play a game asheren . Let's pretend the UK never joined the EEC and are about to hold a vote whether to join the now EU . What's the benefits ? How will the EU enrich the UK because to be frank I ain't seeing it .
                You don't see it because you were benefiting from it for last 40 years.Dude your country was worst performing free market economy in 70s on continent. You needed a bloody IMF bailout in 76.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Mordoror View Post

                  I have understood that but the issue goes beyond this because it is opening a legal clusterfuck
                  In both ways


                  I have an example in mind : the world leader of ropes (BEAL) is french but its certification agency is in UK. The certification is EU compliant. But if UK leaves, even if EU compliant, the ropes won't be certified legally and this will happen overnight. Technically they will be OK but not administratively
                  Unless the EU accepts UK certification as acceptable.

                  Although I am cetain the biggest loser will be the UK, a hard Brexit is a mess for everyone, and i don´t think the EU countries will play things by the book...since there is´nt any book


                  Originally posted by bfc1001 View Post

                  Ok , let's play a game asheren . Let's pretend the UK never joined the EEC and are about to hold a vote whether to join the now EU . What's the benefits ? How will the EU enrich the UK because to be frank I ain't seeing it .
                  Well that´s not realistic since you would have to imagine your economy doing business alone with the commonwealth countries that found it advantageous to trade with the UK rather than the rest of the EU...you would have to picture your economy in the early seventies...that was growing slower than economies in other countries in Europe.

                  That´s how Maggie got the rebate...in the early eighties, the UK was not very rich per capita when compared with other European nations.

                  Comment


                  • Whilst the May Agreement is bogged down, given that it is 550+ pages I bet there are clauses in it that cover many of of the points you guys are raising. All it needs is business pressure on the politicians to get the details sorted and that won't happen until there is real pressure on supply lines or economic costs rearing their head.

                    Comment


                    • https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...s-george-soros

                      Opinion piece in the guardian by George Soros of all people . Make of it what you will . There is rumours of possibly a new political party being formed in the UK made up of Tory / labour defectors . Not sure if this is the media s attempt to lay down the groundworks ......

                      Comment


                      • Any talk that mentions the UK taking part in the May EU elections seems to be on pretty shaky ground. As loads of ex UK empty seats in the EU Parliament was never going to happen, all the UK’s seats have been redistributed during the past two years with changes to electoral areas across the EU. The EU agreeing to, let alone being able to reverse, these changes is nil. So count that out and is probably the reason Nigel is very low profile on the subject, someone else already has dibs on his seat there.
                        I can’t see the EU showing any weakness or generosity towards the UK in negotiations ahead of those elections, other than in detailed technical points to get trade moving post the 29th, it would just add fuel to the populist fires that they are desperate to damp down. They have to be seen to make it painful for anyone to leave. Compound this with the problems in the French and German economies Brexit has moved to being yesterday’s worry.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by JohninMK View Post
                          Any talk that mentions the UK taking part in the May EU elections seems to be on pretty shaky ground. As loads of ex UK empty seats in the EU Parliament was never going to happen, all the UK’s seats have been redistributed during the past two years with changes to electoral areas across the EU. The EU agreeing to, let alone being able to reverse, these changes is nil. So count that out and is probably the reason Nigel is very low profile on the subject, someone else already has dibs on his seat there.
                          I can’t see the EU showing any weakness or generosity towards the UK in negotiations ahead of those elections, other than in detailed technical points to get trade moving post the 29th, it would just add fuel to the populist fires that they are desperate to damp down. They have to be seen to make it painful for anyone to leave. Compound this with the problems in the French and German economies Brexit has moved to being yesterday’s worry.
                          The EU will not be impartial/nuetral during Indyref2 like they were during Indyref in 2014

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by JohninMK View Post
                            Any talk that mentions the UK taking part in the May EU elections seems to be on pretty shaky ground. As loads of ex UK empty seats in the EU Parliament was never going to happen, all the UK’s seats have been redistributed during the past two years with changes to electoral areas across the EU. The EU agreeing to, let alone being able to reverse, these changes is nil. So count that out and is probably the reason Nigel is very low profile on the subject, someone else already has dibs on his seat there.
                            I can’t see the EU showing any weakness or generosity towards the UK in negotiations ahead of those elections, other than in detailed technical points to get trade moving post the 29th, it would just add fuel to the populist fires that they are desperate to damp down. They have to be seen to make it painful for anyone to leave. Compound this with the problems in the French and German economies Brexit has moved to being yesterday’s worry.
                            I think same can be said about US, Russia or Chinese. In current geopolitical conditions where global superpowers are increasingly protectionist... UK should not count on any generous terms of trade deals they might want to make.

                            Still i would not be supprised tho if UK is immediatly approached by Russia seeking to drive wedge with EU deeper, bypass sanctions and seek to gain some level of control over UK throu "gas valve" import politics.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by JohninMK View Post
                              Any talk that mentions the UK taking part in the May EU elections seems to be on pretty shaky ground. As loads of ex UK empty seats in the EU Parliament was never going to happen, all the UK’s seats have been redistributed during the past two years with changes to electoral areas across the EU. The EU agreeing to, let alone being able to reverse, these changes is nil. So count that out and is probably the reason Nigel is very low profile on the subject, someone else already has dibs on his seat there.
                              I can’t see the EU showing any weakness or generosity towards the UK in negotiations ahead of those elections, other than in detailed technical points to get trade moving post the 29th, it would just add fuel to the populist fires that they are desperate to damp down. They have to be seen to make it painful for anyone to leave. Compound this with the problems in the French and German economies Brexit has moved to being yesterday’s worry.
                              I would say that is an accurate assessment of the situation . It had crossed my mind that remainer MP s could force an article 50 extension forcing EU elections and using it as a "soft 2 nd referendum" vote . It would of course need all EU27 members to agree which I don't see happening .

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Asheren View Post

                                I think same can be said about US, Russia or Chinese. In current geopolitical conditions where global superpowers are increasingly protectionist... UK should not count on any generous terms of trade deals they might want to make.

                                Still i would not be supprised tho if UK is immediatly approached by Russia seeking to drive wedge with EU deeper, bypass sanctions and seek to gain some level of control over UK throu "gas valve" import politics.
                                I don't see it . The UK is too closely alligned to the US for that to happen , not that I buy into all this Russia hysteria created over the last few years . Italy's your country to watch regards that particular department . Depending on how trade goes post Brexit Italy has the power to veto sanctions should they see fit .

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X